Re: Bidi-less Applications Patching Policy

[Muhammad Alkarouri <malkarouri at yahoo dot co dot uk>]

First of all, I am not resentful of the Core committee. Not on the existence
nor in the principle that it should be small. Two points, though:

- Core does not exist to stifle discussions. By the way I don't attribute it to
all core members, only some of them display this attitude.

- Second thing is that other members and member opinions are useful resources
for Core. I expect to be able to say my opinion (with no exaggeration/nagging)
and then core can decide what is best for Arabeyes. Not discovering a problem,
thinking about it themselves, solving it, and then passing it for us to
implement.

 --- Mohammed Elzubeir <elzubeir at arabeyes dot org> wrote: 
> Well, allow me to remind you then ;) Seriously, Core is completely
> pointless if there are people (again, the keyword here is sizeable,
> since someone, somewhere, always will nto be happy bout something)., who
> are completely unhappy with their decisions.

And people are completely pointless if core is to use its brain muscles without
others help (see above).

> What sentence? I make no assumptions. I am simply noting that n oone
> voiced concerns other than the people I mentioned.

Exactly, so don't present it as a 5 versus 2 decision. That's what I meant.

> There are no 'votes' in Arabeyes yet (outside of Core)

Exactly, so don't present it as a 5 versus 2 decision. That's what I meant.

> Are you serious? We have had a very long thread on this, and all I heard
> was "no no no".. and never heard, "How about we solve this by doing x, y
> ,z." 

About what? I believe you are mixing things now. The PuTTY case was a singular
case (and was under Windows, for that matter, and friBiDi does not enjoy that
status in Windows, so less problems).
As for the CUPS thread, just note the dates:
- Ahmad notes that CUPS don't like LGPL in 24 May
(http://lists.arabeyes.org/archives/developer/2004/May/msg00200.html). This is
the first actual proof of a problem there.
- You publish the BiDi policy in 26 May
(http://lists.arabeyes.org/archives/developer/2004/May/msg00220.html).
So what you are saying 'a very long thread' actually had a 24 hours span of
actual discussion. But you were relaying on the PuTTY thing..

> 
> > I am really sorry. I have already objected to irc discussions before and I 
> > believe we have already lost some things for that. So as not to repeat
> myself,
> > see:http://lists.arabeyes.org/archives/developer/2004/May/msg00128.html
> > By the way, I am behind a firewall with no irc access..
> 
> I don't see the relationship, but okay.

The point is: irc has no backup (we cannot refer to it later) and other people
will not be aware of the discussion. So probably the same discussion will be
repeated again and again. And some possible contributors will not give their
opinions.

> Being behind a firewall is
> another issue (always ways around, but, hey, if you don't want to show
> up, or don't want it, don't like it, don't care, whatever.. that's your
> business).

Thanks. Believe me I cannot. When you are behind a firewall and you have strong
sense of security and do not like to hack it, that means you cannot, because it
is illegal.

> Good, I am glad those "sponsors" think like me then. Nah nah na!

And they don't support FSF:)

> You mean all the.. headaches are not enough? ;)

You should've told me. I receive your cheques regularly;)

> We have tried to contact the "authorities" and still to no avail. This
> is an on-going challenge and we are all aware of it. 

While you are doing that, do the things that you can. Use available
dictionaries technical and otherwise. How much does an ALESCO dictionary cost,
by the way?

> > - Let's redo FriBiDi.
> 
> Again, suggest viable alternatives.

Remember, you didn't convince me there was a problem till the 24th, and you
decided a day after.

> Hey, if you are looking to "gain" something, you are at the wrong place
> ;)

Let me tell you something, I am here to gain. To gain Arabic support in open
source, to gain open source for the Arab people, to gain experience that is
already there, not to duplicate it.

> Mr. Karouri, you are free to do whatever you like. Your contributions to
> Arabeyes in their Open Source efforts are commendable if not needed
> still. However, no one is going to force you do something you apparently
> no longer want to do. I think your reasons are ambiguous and rather
> unreasonable.

Thanks for you kind words. I know I didn't explain it clearly enough. But I
expect by the sum of my e-mails today you are understanding it more and more.

> I do sense some resentment to the whole concept of 'core' in your emails
> and I am not sure I appreciate it.

See above.

> You want to fork BiCon or any other project, again, that's up to you.
> The license says you can.. go for it! The license also says it has to be
> GPL+Python+BSD.. wow.. good luck with that mess, especially if your
> secret "sponsor" or "big brhter" or whatever, is not intending to keep
> it that way to be "happy"? Are you seeing the strangeness in all of
> this?

That mess is altogether GPL compatible. Don't worry about that.

> Dammit Mohammed, we had lunch at that crappy restaurant in Khartoum!
> 

Believe me, it is the best open source lunch I had:)

Salam,
Muhammad Alkarouri


	
	
		
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