Re: fribidi + joining/shaping

[Munzir Taha <munzirtaha at myrealbox dot com>]

I am still trying to do the homework ...
0649; ALEF MAKSURA; D; YEH
06CC; DOTLESS YEH; D; YEH
I think this should be
0649; ALEF MAKSURA; R; YEH
06CC; DOTLESS YEH; R; YEH

I think I could find more but it's prayer time now. Also  I don't know how 
they differ from each other both are written as
ى
I know I will be wrong somewhere because it's unreasonable that all the world 
has skipped such a thing on various versions of Unicode but just to say I am 
trying ;-)

> BTW, just out of curiosity, how many people here are members of the
> "unicode at unicode dot org" mailing list?
I _was_ a member before. I subsribed to the mailing list to ask them how to 
write an Arabic square root symol in whatever application in whatever 
platform. I found this couldn't be done and a war exists between font and 
applications desiners who should implement it. Then, unsubscribed sadly :-(

Munzir Taha,
New Horizons Computer Learning Centers,
Riyadh, Saudi Arabia
<clever way to ask offtopic questions>
Untill I could find how to restore a file from the recycle bin to its original 
location in KDE, and know how to play audio CD's through the speakers wihout 
the audio connector attached between the CD-ROM and the sound card like in 
Windows Media Player, linux is not ready for the Desktop ;-) </clever way to 
ask offtopic questions>



في 8:00 م خميس 26 ديسمبر 2002، developer-request at arabeyes dot org كتبت:

> --- Roozbeh Pournader <roozbeh sharif edu> wrote:
> > On Tue, 10 Dec 2002, Behdad Esfahbod wrote:
> > > BTW, Just now Roozbeh is in Tokyo for an ISO meeting.  He is
> > > supposed to discuss the matter with other Unicode guys.  I will
> > > write the ideas when I find whats going in there.
> >
> > Sadly nothing happened about bidi vs. joining in the ISO JTC1/SC2 meeting
> > in Tokyo. Neither Mark Davis nor any other Bidi expert was attending.
> > Ken Whistler, one of Unicode editors, told me that we will need to write
> > a proposal with good visual examples, if we don't want things to get
> > standardized in the wrong way.
> >
> > Just as you have been guessing, the final hope is me and Behdad again ;)
>
> I'm hoping we can possibly get involved in this "final hope" as well :-)
>
> So if there are documents/ideas/etc that you guys (Roozbeh & Behdad) have
> and are sharing and talking about, we'd love to see them and help out; its
> only logical for all of us to work together (the more eyes, the more brains
> the better).  If we are deemed too slow (ie. not upto speed on certain
> issues), we'll gladly do extra homework to catchup given a bit of guidance.
>
> As for joining Unicode - we'll be talking internally about the Liaison
> option (or whatever it was called - the one that didn't cost anything),
> unless the donations start pouring in :-)  Your sponsorship deal, I
> must admit, sounds very appealing (you guys must be good negotiators :-)
>
> Thanks again for your info and let's start sharing/working on this topic
> together; sound reasonable ?
>
> Salam.
>
>  - Nadim
>
>
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>
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 02:53:46 +0330 (IRT)
> From: Roozbeh Pournader <roozbeh at sharif dot edu>
> To: developer at arabeyes dot org
> Subject: Re: fribidi + joining/shaping
> Reply-To: developer at arabeyes dot org
>
> On Wed, 25 Dec 2002, Nadim Shaikli wrote:
> > So if there are documents/ideas/etc that you guys (Roozbeh & Behdad) have
> > and are sharing and talking about, we'd love to see them and help out;
>
> OK, we will post the document here when it emerged.
>
> > its only logical for all of us to work together (the more eyes, the more
> > brains the better).
>
> You are definitely right, but even even I have problems understanding the
> complications of Bidi. And specially since ZWNJ and ZWJ are involved in
> the game (which are rare in Arabic), honestly, I don't think Arabeyes
> people will be able to help much.
>
> > we'll gladly do extra homework to catchup given a bit of guidance.
>
> OK, Homework 1:
>
> Study the Unicode 3.0 section on Arabic thoroughly. Check Unicode 3.1 and
> 3.2 to see the changes that has been made to it. Try to understand *every*
> detail, specially the notion of character sequence <ZWNJ, ZWJ, ZWNJ>.
>
> Homework 2:
>
> Suggest re-wordings to make these more clear. Best comments will be
> collected and sent to Unicode editors to be incorporated in Unicode 4.0.
>
> Homework 3:
>
> Study the Unicode Bidirectional Algorithm. Think about possible problems
> that may rise in interactions between Bidi and Joining, specially ZWNJ and
> ZWJ, and Arabic text in overridden Left-to-Right mode.
>
> > As for joining Unicode - we'll be talking internally about the Liaison
> > option (or whatever it was called - the one that didn't cost anything),
>
> Please do so. CC me in case of any difficulties. I have just met some of
> the Unicode officers, and may be able to provide some help.
>
> > Your sponsorship deal, I must admit, sounds very appealing (you guys
> > must be good negotiators :-)
>
> We can try that, but being a member of Bidi doesn't help much if you can't
> access the L2/UTC document repository which is password-protected and only
> for members. You will see people discussing some number referring to a
> document, and get into more confusions.
>
> > Thanks again for your info and let's start sharing/working on this topic
> > together; sound reasonable ?
>
> Sure. But the sad point is that Behdad is changing his opinion everyday ;)
>
> BTW, just out of curiosity, how many people here are members of the
> "unicode at unicode dot org" mailing list?
>
> roozbeh