Re: Quranic Proposal

[Nadim Shaikli <shaikli at yahoo dot com>]

Please bare with me here - I'm collecting various notes from various posts
in this thread in an attempt to bring us to a collective conclusion.

--- Thomas Milo <t dot milo at chello dot nl> wrote:
> The only possibility to accomplish a robust solution for encoding the
> Qur'an - or any Classical Arabic for that matter - in the Unicode format
> would be designing a code set from scratch and apply for it's inclusion in
> the second plain as Historic or Diachronic Arabic. This is exactly what I am
> working on, including the conversion schemes to upgrade the Arabic
> industrlal rubbish in Unicode or interchange with it.

> --- abdulhaq <al-arabeyes at alinsyria dot fsnet dot co dot uk> wrote:
> > 3 - Phased approach
> > 
> > I concur with Nadim about correcting of the situation in two phases,
> > the  first which allows all operating systems (not just Windows) to
> > output these extra characters without changes to core services such
> > as font renderers. OK it may in your view be a bit of a kludge, but
> > by your own understanding the whole thing is already a kludge. The
> > second phase can get it _right_ in the ways you are proposing. Even
> > then though I believe that the tajweed markers are characters with
> > genuine meaning and not just glyph combinations.
>
> I agree with the phased approach, but we need to agree on the phases. If
> your operating systems cannot handle fonts the way it is assumed by the
> Unicode Standard, than I would agree with you that you need to opt for
> kludges.

Not sure what the operating system(s) have to do with this, but OK.  I
think what is being said here is to use the current kludged Unicode
framework and specifications and add minimally to them while also working
on a rehauled approach to this entire topic.

> Just count me out.

Ummm.  Out of what exactly ?  I don't see such statements serving anyone's
interest - are you simply saying that you agree with the phases and that
there is merit to the idea, but you are unwilling/uninterested in pursuing
the first (phase-1) aspect of it (the asking of the missing characters or
there-abouts).  If you have different phases in mind, what are they ?

> What I am saying all the time is that - with some extra effort - it
> is very well possible even within the constraints of the present
> Arabic Block in Unicode. But to get good looking result, you need
> Unicode compatible font technology.

And here-in lies a major point.  As we agree with your aims 100% and we
want to even pursue 'em and forge ahead with them (post more details
are divulged, etc) we are also looking to patch what is out there now
to get the current system in place to be functional.  So again I think
we are talking about 2 different things here and both need to be talked
about and addressed separately (although in the long-run the new
approach (DecoType's) is a superset of the current issues).

> --- Mohammed Yousif wrote:
> > I'm afraid your goal "which I really appreciate btw" is different
> > than mine.
> >
> > My goal is to make Unicode able to render the hard-copy of the
> > Qur'an certified by all related Islamic organizations today.
> > My goal is to make Unicode compliant with the current Arabic so
> > that we can use it.
> 
> This is my short term goal, too. There is one difference: I can do it
> already.

Without changes to the rendering engine or underlying framework that is
out there ?  Again, let's not rehash and go in circles (I'm guessing
the answer to that last question is no).  If the answer is YES, then
please tell us how we'd go about accomplishing that.

It seems as though all agree on a phased solution, so let's approach
it from that end and move forward with that.  Let's propose the needed
characters (yeah yeah I know - they are not really characters but since
there is plenty of wrong precedence in unicode to this regard, we'll keep
playing along) so that what is currently being used on various systems
will continue to be usable (which will allow the rendering of the Quran
in a usable, standard manner) while researching and finalizing on a
complete overhaul to how Arabic is being treated by Unicode.

Salam.

 - Nadim


	
		
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